#48 | Darine with Stachen Frederick: The Living Legacy Of Black Women Leaders
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[00:00:00] Darine: It is not secret that the achievements of black women leaders and women of color in general have often been overshadowed and ignorant.
[00:00:11] Darine: Hello, welcome, and salem anleykoum! This is STANDOUT From The Crowd, the first live podcast dedicated to no BS leadership. So if you like us, tell your friends and colleagues to go over on, apple podcast, spotify to give us a five star review because we deserve it, right? We are worth it. We are talking about important topics here, inspiration, motivation, and most importantly, all the leaders who come on this podcast actually share with you their blueprint to success. So you can just learn and take the shortcuts.
[00:00:48] Darine: Our STANDOUT guest today is Stachen Frederick, has been named one of Canada's top 100 powerful women and she's the recipient of a number of academic and social impact awards.. She is a big deal. I'm telling you people, she is a big deal. And so during our conversation, she will share her journey to becoming the leader she was meant to be, making an impact in the most vulnerable communities and building a lasting legacy. So please help me welcome Stachen on the STANDOUT Podcast.
[00:01:23] Darine: Hello!
[00:01:24] Stachen: Hello, thank you for having me.
[00:01:27] Darine: How are you doing today?
[00:01:28] Stachen: I am well, I am, well, it's my birthday week, so I am definitely, taking some self-care time, but happy to come on for a few minutes to have this conversation with you, which is of course something that I'm so passionate about.
[00:01:45] Darine: Wonderful and happy birthday week. Then when is your birthday?
[00:01:49] Stachen: So it was actually on Monday on Family Day, that was my birthday. So we celebrated Family Day here in Ontario.
[00:01:58] Darine: Okay. You know, I like to celebrate, so I don't have a week birthday, personally, I have the birthday month, right? So all the month of June, I celebrate myself.
[00:02:08] Stachen: Absolutely, absolutely love it, love it.
[00:02:15] Darine: So if your family, if the people who know you well had to describe you with one word, what would be that word?
[00:02:27] Stachen: Oof! That's a powerful one. Yeah I love this one, yeah.
[00:02:31] Darine: And, we are going to talk about it all, along this conversation, because your journey is definitely inspiring and requires , like a fearless mindset, hundred percent.
[00:02:43] Stachen: Yeah.
[00:02:43] Darine: So you, you have an extensive you have built an extensive career in community development work, right? And I'm always fascinated by people who have dedicated their career and their life to helping supporting others. So my question to you is, where did this passion come from for helping others?
[00:03:10] Stachen: So I always had an interest in helping and supporting others. When I was eight years old, I told my mom while living in Trinidad at that point in time, that I was going to go abroad to help children. And I also had a nicknamed they call me Florence Nightingale because I always wanted to you know, help people, nurse people.
[00:03:46] Stachen: And you know, recently I was doing a video for Ivy, where I just did my MBA. And my mother was there. I just also have a newborn. And my mom came up and she was helping me and we went to this video shoot. And while I'm doing my video shoot, she's in the back talking to a bunch of women and they asked her this question, you know, how did you get this powerful daughter?
[00:04:16] Stachen: And, you know, she said something. When they ask for advice around motherhood, your children tell you who they are from very young. And so from very young, as I said, I had this passion of wanting to help people. Now, ironically where I've ended up in my career is not where I initially started.
[00:04:42] Stachen: Because being smart, I was sort of weaned into the sciences. And so it was a part way of me looking at going, I got a scholarship to do chemistry at the University of Ottawa. I was going to do chemistry, then go to medical school and then specialize in child psychiatry. I, again, always wanted to help children.
[00:05:13] Stachen: But while at university I did an elective in psychology and realized that my part to what I wanted to do in life, which was helping children didn't have to go through that part where that I didn't really want to go. And that's one of the, one of the advice that I give to a lot of young people.
[00:05:34] Stachen: There is a goal, but the way to get to the goal could look very different. And so, you follow your heart, follow your mind, listen to people, talk to a lot of people, connect with various individuals, connect with people like myself, and that people can help you along that journey to where you would like to be in.
[00:06:00] Darine: That's very important and it's a journey actually, right? If you're like me, if you are watching, listening to us, and you're like me, like for the longest time I didn't know what I wanted to do with my life. So Stachen when I see you and hear you, I'm like, wow... so since the very young age, she knew what she wanted to do.
[00:06:20] Darine: It was very clear to her, right? And I love that your work has been recognized over and over again across Canada. overseas. Now, as you said, you moved to Canada as an immigrant, right? And I always love to hear the story, you know, from women who came here with a dream, with a project vision and ambition and that who were able to materialize it to the point that they are gaining recognition from you know, their peers and from the country they are living in now that they call home now.
[00:06:59] Stachen: Yes.
[00:07:00] Darine: So can you tell us a little bit more about your journey, like to become a recognized leader in your industry? What was the aha moment or the shift when you realized that, oh, I'm making an impact and this is getting a recognition?
[00:07:18] Stachen: Well, you know, as all the awards stand behind me here, you know, I never do this work for recognition. And even when I do receive all these recognitions right now, it's really about, the platform that I'm able to utilize to speak about the community issues. So from my thing, what is the use of a platform if you're not able to really help, influence, change?
[00:07:54] Stachen: But to your question about when you know, I realized that I'm such an impactful leader. I'll say there's probably two points. It probably was my first award, which it was from Black History Ottawa. It was a community development award, a youth award for my work with young people in the black community in Ottawa.
[00:08:28] Stachen: So I would say that first one. And so even just hearing the word community development was something that I wasn't even aware of. I was just acting from a place, I'm realizing that there's a need in my community, there was not people rising up to the challenge and just doing it, and then I received that award, that community development award. And so then that even tuned into what does community development look like? So that actually then set a part way of like, this is even more what I want to do. Because again, it was, it went from psychiatry to psychology. It's a community development.
[00:09:15] Darine: Community?
[00:09:16] Stachen: Yes, community development and social work, right? And each one is different. So psychiatry is more about medicine. Psychology, you're thinking about the brain biology, the neurons and what not, and then you look at community development and social work, which looks more around. What's happening with the individual from their environment, and we'll talk about things such as oppression and, you know, societal norms and family dynamics, all those different pieces.
[00:09:51] Stachen: I would say the award that really sort of stood home for me was when I received the top 10 women Award in Canada by L'Oreal Canada. My face was plastered on a billboard in downtown, Toronto, but..Um, a story, I'm always a storyteller. I always have a story.
[00:10:20] Stachen: And so again, I go back to something with my mom. So my mom was traveling in Europe. She had gone to I believe it was Morocco, but was using Europe as one of those you know, main steps to travel. And she's in Europe and she's in an airport and she ends up speaking to some man in a lounge.
[00:10:42] Stachen: And saying that her daughter is in Canada, and she has this organization called Braids for aids. And you know, she's this top 10 women Award, and he's like, of course I know about her. I saw her on this billboard.
[00:10:58] Darine: Oh my god. Small world.
[00:11:00] Stachen: Small world, small world. And, but, but the real impact was how he talked about how my work around H I V AIDS has really shifted how we engage the black community around H I V AIDS aids. So I think it's those types of moments or when I have, you know, young woman I at a time. Actually it was that same day of receiving the Woman of Worth award. I rushed over to an event where the Prime Minister was at and a young lady.
[00:11:36] Stachen: So I'm shaking Justin Trudeau's hand and a young lady instead of like going, oh my God, Justin Truder. She goes, oh my God, station surgery.
[00:11:47] Darine: Amazing, I love that.
[00:11:49] Stachen: You know, those where yes, I say yeah, I've made an impact, not just on the work that I do, but I've made an impact on young women aspiring in different different sectors, but particularly in the community development, sector.
[00:12:08] Darine: So here again is the importance. It showcases the importance of increasing your visibility. I'm all about visibility. I'm all about standing out from the crowd, and that's why, you know, I have created this platform to share stories like stage and stories to show you that it does work, but you have to make yourself visible.
[00:12:29] Darine: So maybe not on a billboard in downtown city, right. But you have to make yourself visible, your work visible, your impact visible, otherwise it's not going to benefit the people that you wanna impact the most, right?
[00:12:45] Stachen: Absolutely.
[00:12:46] Darine: So, we know that getting into leadership, has its own set of challenges, right?
[00:12:54] Darine: It's particularly true for women and especially more for women of color and racialized women. We were having this conversation earlier where I was talking about the stats, right? And it's out there, it's public information where when you look at the leadership pipeline you will find fewer women as you grow, as you grow up, you find fewer women, but then you will find a racialized woman, latin woman, and black woman at the bottom. So what are some of the key lessons that you have learned as a leader and you believe could impact the future of leadership for women and for women of color.
[00:13:36] Stachen: Mm-hmm.
[00:13:37] Stachen: Well, I just want to, before I even speak about that, I just want to even say, you know, that stats is so real. Even when we call stats, it's about the impact and feelings about being the only one. So I recently completed my Executive MBA at Ivey business school, and I was only black woman in my class a nd there was only one other black person in the class and it felt very isolating. And so, you know, when I talk ab when you ask this question about, you know, the future of black woman leadership, there's a call for many of us to pull others along that train, right? And so we want to see more women of color in leadership positions, but understand that there are many barriers.
[00:14:46] Stachen: There's the barrier of race, there's the barrier of gender, sometimes even the barrier of age, what you see as well, for a lot of black women who have this ambition for leadership, that they try to get into leadership positions very young, and so they meet up with that all additional barrier of age. And so I think there, there needs to be opportunities from even younger than we think to start developing young black women. So it's not just about you know, me at this stage talking to the next black woman who already have this leadership pathway established is getting more and more to young girls in elementary school.
[00:15:47] Stachen: Even I would go as much as even kindergarten. How will we, how are we engaging? And so, you know, someone asked me to, you know, now that I'm a mother, what would I want for my daughter? And it's, is those opportunities for her to show those leadership skills, you know, are you engaging them in, you know, into Montessori and how are they, you know, helping to lead activities.
[00:16:23] Stachen: So we have to develop our young girls from young. So I would say that piece you know, other things that I would say is that, never be afraid to be the one to speak up and to stand out. And you know, I can think back of so many, you know, times in my life where if I didn't say what was needed to be said, that it could have changed and gone into a different trajectory. So, you know, be the one to speak up and stand out, and ensure that change happens.
[00:17:06] Stachen: So I go back even again to my business school experience, being the one, one only and only woman black woman. And then, but that was also during the time of George Floyd. And so, you know, it's not okay to just say, okay, this happened to a black man. What is gonna happen to the curriculum that we're now teaching to the future leaders?
[00:17:39] Stachen: Are we ensuring that there is diversity and social inclusion topics within the curriculum at Ivey? You know, this is one of the best business schools in Canada. And I'm so thankful that at the time of having, when George Floyd happened, there was an individual, in sort of the leadership position at Ivey Mary Gillette, who really embodies this kindness and wanting to ensure that there's social change as an ally. And that, you know, now that this curriculum has been developed and changed. Imagine people like myself and other women who said, you know, racialized women who said, this needs to change and we were able to change an institution that is huge.
[00:18:39] Stachen: We were able in the first time in Ivey's history to have a black scholarship for people to enter into a business school in the executive. In 2021, could you imagine? And so if we didn't speak up, if we didn't call for change, change would not happen. And as a leader, you must be that one to step out and to stand out to make that change.
[00:19:12] Darine: Yeah, to make the change for what you believe in, right? Based on your own life experience, and I think this is where, there is a gap maybe where not enough of us as. And we will face the or maybe unfairness, even though the word is not fair, that's the way it is. But we just think unconsciously, oh, it's because I'm an immigrant. Oh, it's because I'm a racialized woman. Oh, it's because... no. You know, like if you feel in at your core that there is something that you can change, that you feel that you wanna speak up, do it, because if you don't do it, either someone else will do it and may not, it might not reflect, you know, the impact and the idea that you had in mind, or, you know, it will just stay the same for everyone and for the future generation to come. So what you're seeing here is very, very important.
[00:20:04] Darine: So now as you said, you are the founder of braids for aids, a non-for-profit organization to raise awareness on H I V AIDS, in the African Caribbean, black communities in Canada and internationally through a culturally relevant practice of hair braiding.
[00:20:19] Darine: I love that. And you are also the current ED of WesternFrontlines Center. So nonetheless, to say that you are a very busy woman. Yeah, yeah. And you have touched based, on it already, but what is the lasting impact you would like to make? If there was one thing that you would like to people to remember about you, what would that be?
[00:20:49] Darine: That, that's a tough question.
[00:20:52] Stachen: Absolutely, absolutely. You know, I've been asked a question like that before, and you know, in these two words, I think that summed it up, but, that she lived, that I lived, and that in my living that others were made better because of it. And I will say this.
[00:21:24] Stachen: Years ago, there was a young man who has made an impact on my career. I don't know if he knows that was gonna, was, to tell him today because he sent me a message and this is a young man, who, when I moved to Toronto was one of the first youth that I was counseling that I was supporting, and he really changed how I lead, how I interact with young people and the impact that I would want for young people. So I think that's my key area. While I do HIV AIDS work, even when I do H I V AIDS work, I focus a lot on young people. So my passion is really about youth. But, this young man, you know, had a lot of challenges, in the school system.
[00:22:21] Stachen: And I remember a white teacher telling him in front of me that she would like to be proven wrong, but this young man will not reach college. That's what she said to him in front of me. So could you imagine the thing she would say to him if an adult was not there? And a few years afterwards, after working with him for a very long time, he graduated from school and he was going off to college and I saw him walk across, the stage and I so happened to see that, guidance counselor and walked up to her and I said, so I guess you were proven wrong. And in that moment I said, if I helped no more children in the world, I was okay because I helped that.
[00:23:23] Stachen: One young man, one. And so it's just one that, it's just one person that you need to leave that legacy. This young man still follows my career, even though that's almost 12, 13 years of things still, follows my career. So, I know I have made an impact for black youth.
[00:23:56] Stachen: I would say the final piece of the is, now while, Western Frontlines Center is youth center that focus on racialized youth specific, not even specifically, but most of our youth are black. But it's my real fully dream, to have a center of black excellence, for black youth.
[00:24:29] Stachen: That would be the best sort of legacy that I could lead on.
[00:24:37] Darine: You put it out there, it's going to happen. The Black Excellence center for black youth, this is happening. It's out there. And you know, I strongly believe in the power of attraction, so Absolutely it's gonna happen.
[00:24:50] Stachen: And anything that I have said that I'm going to do in life, I have done it, so look out.
[00:24:56] Darine: Yeah. So look out people. Yes, you know, actually I wanna share a brief story with you because what you're seeing about this young man resonates a lot with me. So I'm French. I was born and raised in France, but I'm from North African background. I'm originally from Tunisia. And so based on the history of the two countries, I'm the first born on my father's side outside of the continent.
[00:25:22] Darine: And so we faced hallenges, right? Because we are more identified as immigrants or we are not French enough, if I can say so, you know? So that's one of the challenge with immigration in every country anyway. And so I remember when I was in secondary school, so in France, the system is a little bit different, but you are in your senior school senior high school.
[00:25:48] Darine: Yes. and you have to make your choices, for what you wanna do the following year, either college, university, and the field that you wanna study. And I went to talk to my professor and I said, hey, you know, this is what I wanna do. And I wanted to do faculty of law and I wanted to study political science, but people, my face and my name and my background. This is not what they do, or this is not what ... let us know that we could do. But I still wanted to go there because this, I was passionate about it. And when I told him what I wanted to do for the following years, he started laughing at me. And he told me, but my poor girl, this is not for people like you.
[00:26:35] Darine: And I remember that. I didn't speak back and I didn't say a word, and I remember I was 13. 14. 14. no I was older than, hold on. 16, 16, 17. Right, right. And, and I remember going home and crying, crying because that was the, I believed in it so much, but because of what I look like and where I come from, it was clear to them and the professor that this is not where I belong to. And so, you know, just to wrap up this short story, I went into the, and I lost four years studying something that I didn't like and I wasn't passionate about, because that's what my teacher had told me that was the only path for me.
[00:27:23] Darine: And then after three and a half year, in the middle of the year, I stopped and I said, no, this is nonsense. I'm about to finish my studies and like I'm not even liking what I'm doing. And so I stopped and I decided to apply by myself into law school to study political science. And I was admitted there right?
[00:27:42] Darine: And so I took control of my life by deciding to go and to go forward for what I wanted to do since day one. But it's true to your point that when you are a young person and that you are looking up to adults to help you and to guide you, and that you face this kind of situation that can break a life and that it does break a lot of youth, you know, in the path that they could have taken for their life.
[00:28:12] Stachen: Yeah. You know what you just said shared here is what so many black youth face every day. Every day. And then we wonder why our young people have mental health issues, why they have, they engage in criminal activity when the people sometimes who are entrusted to provide them with guidance are the ones who are tearing them. And so we must ensure that our schools and communities have positive influences, positive role models for our young people. But thanks for sharing that story, because I'm sure for people listening it, it resonates with them.
[00:29:10] Darine: Yes, exactly and our friend Robert here say: I had a similar experience. You know, it's crazy the things people say to kids to kill their dreams. And to what he is adding, a greedy happens every day, but I'm no longer a youth. And you're a successful black man. You are successful entrepreneur. You're so successful black man, Robert and so I strongly believe that Stachen, as a leader first, as a woman leader and as a black woman leader, you are leaving a lasting legacy. You are already making a huge impact in your community. And not only right, because your words do resonate with a lot of people outside of your community as well, and I wish you all the best and I wanna thank you for being a role model for many other young women here.
[00:30:12] Darine: The goal of this podcast is really to share those stories so you see. This is not only happening to you, there is nothing wrong with you. This is happening to all of us, but still there are ways that you can make it happen, so don't give up on yourself. Don't give up on your dream. No matter what you believe in, no matter what you look like, no matter what your background is, if you have in your head, then you have what it takes to make it a reality no matter what society thinks about it.
[00:30:45] Stachen: And so I just wanna say one thing as you think, this would just be my final piece. I just hope, especially for people of color, for marginalized individuals to understand that you belong, you belong in these leadership roles. You do, and so I'll leave with that.
[00:31:10] Darine: And we are waiting for you, and we are here for you. Okay?
[00:31:13] Stachen: Yeah.
[00:31:13] Darine: So thank you everyone for watching, for leaving the comments. And I see many of you also are watching here. I feel I hope that you will leave this conversation motivated and inspired.
[00:31:27] Darine: Thank you so much Stachen for your time and for opening your heart and sharing story with us. That was very inspiring and I will see you, everyone next week for another live episode of STANDOUT From the Crowd. You take care, you stay safe, and I will see you soon. Bye-bye everyone.
[00:31:48] Darine: Thank you.
